Alex Shoucair, a junior, argues that race relations discussions, such as the recent Hatchet article, are unnecessary.
“Anytime race is raised as some sort of hurdle to be overcome at this school, the dialogue itself becomes the hurdle. Erecting imaginary barriers that suggest we are a culturally insensitive, racially divided student body not only does not improve our situation, it actually impedes us from reaching our ultimate goal of complete harmony. “
Commentary from the opinions editors, op-ed columnists and The Hatchet's Editorial Board
Director of the GW Institute for Nanotechnology Michael Keidar spent the last three years developing a cancer cell-killing medical device that he said could revolutionize the disease’s treatment worldwide.
The problem with growing up is that there is always someone telling us we are not old enough. And yet, you would think that as young adults, we would finally be over it.
What’s not to love about graduation season? It is filled with senior send-offs, family get-togethers and free food.
GWids are the equivalent of students’ social security numbers on campus.
Transfer students do not enroll at GW for the Mount Vernon Campus experience. They come here to take advantage of city life in Foggy Bottom.
As camera flashes flickered over a sea of tassels, two Columbian College of Arts and Science professors urged graduates to cast their fears aside and forge fresh paths to success.
I never understood why people refer to cities as if they were human until I left Sevilla, Spain. My feelings toward leaving my newfound home are so complex, it's as if I am leaving the love of my life.
Vol. 109
An Independent Student Newspaper
Serving The George Washington University Community Since 1904
Agreed!
-From a part Czech and part Puerto Rican mix who also has issues with checking the boxes
Finally someone speaks with some intelligence. When we stop pointing out how different we are all from each other, we will be able to move forward as a united student body. I am so tired of the “self-hating” that Alex writes about.
- From a Jewish girl from NJ who may have checked the Inuit box on her SATs
I disagree. The article provides a forum for black express their feelings of isolation.
Despite the fact that GW has a larger representation of minorities than other local universities there is not a ton of actual integration. The percentage also does not really reflect the US population as a whole or what most people are used to, considering both white and black individuals are more likely to live in communities and go to schools with a higher proportion of their race present. In many ways we are a more segregated society than we were in the 1960′s (I’m not making this up, it’s something I’ve studied extensively).
Differences in opportunity and culture still exist very much in earnest. Differences in opportunity, just like the disparity is wages paid to men and women, need to be acknowledged because they can tell us so much about the world be live in. Plus, living in denial of reality is never good. Differences is culture should be examined, celebrated and shared.
Look, no one is asking you to join the Black Student Union, but just ignoring the fact that white privilege exists in all aspects of our society (from the very overt to the most mundane aspects of life) is just irresponsible.
-From a Jewish girl from MD who wants to talk about race
If anything I would think that students of european, especially western, should be the ones who should feel excluded at GW in addition to much of the overly politically correct world.
Any time diversity becomes a subject this section of the student body becomes the villain for being born from a caucasian background. Such students gain no benefits in modern society because they are assumed to have already received three times the benefits of their ethnic brothers. At GW it is fair to assume that a similar percent of each ethnicity are all equally wealthy meaning that such an argument is void however acceptance rates do not match the general US population. Even accounting for foreign students GW clearly must discriminate against the Caucasian-American race due to their presence lower than the national average. If such discrimination occurred against any other ethnic group you can be sure Al Sharpton or someone similar would be on the steps of the Marvin Center.
Further Caucasian-Americans are a much less cohesive group. Unlike minority groups which each seem to have several different groups that include their cultural identities I am yet to hear of a Anglo-Saxon Student Association. If you want to force such a race dialog I think it makes more sense to tackle the largest ethnic group and stop discrimination against them.
I thought this was a great article. Really – probably one of the best I’ve seen in the Hatchet in a long time.
A few comments on the poster above me: I agree. And I don’t.When we talk about ‘race’ in this country, 95% of the time it’s about black and white. You’re right – there isn’t a whole lot of integration here at GW. On that same note, it’s waaay more ‘integrated’ than my high school – I can count the number of non-white or Asian kids on one hand. So, honestly, for me, coming here was kind of a shock because I don’t really encounter black people at home. Scratch that. The black people I know at home are more members of upper-middle-class-American-culture than of black culture. So it was (and continues to be) an interesting experience for me here.
With that said. Integration is grand, but whose fault is it if black and white kids choose not talk to each other? Maybe it’s because we don’t always have a lot in common. It’s normal for all people to have more in common with one person than another. Face it: in America, for the most part, black and white people have very different cultures. I’m not saying that’s ‘natural’ or ‘correct’ or any other way you could spin what I’m saying: I’m saying that it EXISTS, it HAPPENS, period. Other cultures might be fun as a curiosity, but when it comes to day-to-day friendships, people tend to want to stay to their own culture. So why are we getting all hot and bothered?
I agree with Alex.
“when the last thing we notice is the color of skin/ and the first thing we look for is the beauty within…
when there’s only one race and thats mankind/ we shall be free”
Garth Brooks said it pretty well.
To the article: Well, because you’ve never had this problem, it probably doesn’t exist, right? It’s pretty ridiculous for you to come in and try to say that the experiences of black students at GW are totally invalid because you don’t really get it, and you’re a minority too!
“If anything I would think that students of european, especially western, should be the ones who should feel excluded at GW in addition to much of the overly politically correct world.” – This is the most hilariously privileged thing I’ve read in a while.
Jen: “The black people I know at home are more members of upper-middle-class-American-culture than of black culture.”
Are you kidding me? Please reread that sentence to yourself and ask yourself how that could seem, I don’t know, a little racist, and definitely classist?
Check out the book “Why Are All the Black Kids Sitting Together in the Cafeteria?: And Other Conversations about Race” by Beverly Tatum for an interesting look at race relations in our generation, and why race dialog is important.
Isn’t it at all possible that by continually bringing race to the foreground, we’re doing more harm than good?
This should be a non-issue. Like, “Oh, that guy is (insert race)? cool, let’s move on.”
@ K
I find your response to my comments greatly offensive. You act as if you understand my upbringing as being “privileged”. This could not be further from the truth. If I were not receiving large amounts of financial aid there is no possible way I would be able to attend GW. The point of that statement is that society at this point has decided to turn its focus onto giving non-Caucasian-Americans preferential treatment through programs such as affirmative action. All I am arguing in favor of is to be treated with complete equality to any other person regardless of the color of their skin. To argue anything other than that is pure racism.
@ Don’t Tread on Me
I think you misunderstand what I mean by privileged. You’re talking about class privilege, which can intersect with racial privilege but is not the same thing. If you think there are no benefits, intangible and tangible, that go along with being white, then you have a pretty skewed idea of America today. Programs like affirmative action work to create a parity between races, not elevate minorities above white people. As a white person (I presume), you already hold an elevated status in society.
To argue that you want to be treated equally with marginalized groups is a clear exhibition of privilege, because you are totally dismissing the fact that racism is still a driving force in society. Not acknowledge racism and pretending that in our society racism can just be ignored in favor of “complete equality” is naive at best.
Have some links: Identifying race privilege: One white to another
A Concise history of black-white relations in the USA
@ Don’t Tread on Me
1. I like the name
2. I agree with you.
@ K
I don’t like affirmative action. First, I feel like it is people telling me that because I’m not completely white that I need their help. That is a smack to the face. Secondly, I actually believe in equality – for everyone. Discriminating against a white person because they are white in order to “help” a latino is still racial discrimination and is still wrong.
Honestly, I get annoyed when my fellow latinos or any other ethnic group make such a big deal out of race. Just like Obama – for the most part the only people making an issue out of it is them. Why do minorities sit together in the cafeteria? Because they want to. Is that a problem? No. However, society automatically assumes that if all the minorities are sitting together, it isn’t because they want to, its because the mean white people are racist.
Like I said before, I’m for equality and against discrimination…but I actually mean it. I too am arguing that I want to be treated equally with “marginalized groups”, am I showing a clear exhibition of privilege too? Or am I just a poor misguided latina?
@ Britt
How would you suggest making up the difference for minorities (and I’ll go ahead and include the economically disadvantaged there)? Should a latin@ person with an ethnic name just accept the fact that homeownership, loans, job interviews will be harder for him/her to get and move on with it?
If you’re against discrimination then how would you suggest ended institutionalized discrimination without programs such as affirmative action?
@ Britt
Thank you for your support on both 1. and 2.
@ K
“Programs like affirmative action work to create a parity between races, not elevate minorities above white people” By working to achieve such a parity you must assume that they either are at a lower level in society or an equal level. If they are at a lower level then in order to get to a presumed “equality” they must receive preferential treatment meaning that they are treated better than the average person. On the other side if they are not at a lower level then such minorities are gaining advantages that they do not need.
Also you argue racism is still an ever-present specter in America today. While I could go the easy route and point to the president to prove you wrong I think it is better to take a different approach.
Seeing as affirmative action benefits minority students while doing nothing to help Caucasian-Americans it is logical to say that the American government is pursuing racist policies. Affirmative action is in place in order to counter the assumed racism that prevents the minority from achieving. However by giving such groups that benefit by giving them preferential treatment, elevating them into superior schools and jobs Caucasian-Americans find the number of possible openings in both to be much harder to obtain through no fault of their own. Such a Caucasian-American likely has never taken any racist actions whether it be using racial slurs to having their great-great-great grandfather owning slaves, however they are still forced to suffer as if they had.
Looks like this entire discussion basically defeats the point of the article itself (that we shouldn’t have to have a forced dialogue on race). Though I guess it is good that this discussion is mostly about whether we should talk about race at all, rather than talking about race.
I also think its funny (and timely) that Obama basically bitch-slapped AttyGen Holder yesterday
@ Don’t Tread On Me
“Also you argue racism is still an ever-present specter in America today. While I could go the easy route and point to the president to prove you wrong I think it is better to take a different approach.”
That doesn’t make sense. Please explain how the election of a black president negates all racism in America.
The rest of your argument: I’d like to see some statistics on affirmative action (at least in its current form). But even a non-racist Caucasian is still benefiting from previous racism — that’s the whole idea of white privilege. You get it whether you asked for it or not. That’s the whole point.
So you’re getting financial aid — but that doesn’t do anything to help out people who are already rich? Would you then call financial aid a classist policy, even though it exists to create a parity between lower economic brackets and higher ones? I mean, a richer student’s great great great grandfather could have been poor.
There is much discussion about how minorities are segregated from the student body as a whole here at GW yet these same minority groups hold “Black Graduation” and “Asian Graduation” If the minority groups want people to stop treating them as different they need to stop treating themselves as different
At the start of this debate, I agreed more with K, but after Britt’s post (and some of the points that Don’t Tread on Me) made, they have really brought me around to their side.
K, while I see why and how you are framing your arguments, you are starting to get on my nerves.
A little reality check: race and class distinctions EXIST and they MATTER. Are they pleasant topics? No. But to go about as if they are invisible and unimportant is, while well-intentioned, ridiculous.
“I mean, a richer student’s great great great grandfather could have been poor.” It looks to me like you just proved DTOM’s point: to base government benefits (affirmative action) on family history is ridiculous. And on the whole white privilege thing: my ancestors weren’t even in America during slavery. In fact, an significant majority of them were Irish and Italian, two ethnic groups that experienced widespread discrimination. So I should get an advantage when applying to jobs because my Irish ancestors were barred from certain professions. Right?
@K
“Please explain how the election of a black president negates all racism in America.” The mention of Obama was the concept many people in the media were pitching around that with the election of Obama it was a new chapter in race relations even up to the point of calling it an end to racism. I find this argument to be weak however thought it was relevant to mention even if I had no plans of going into depth on it.
“Even a non-racist Caucasian is still benefiting from previous racism.” How do I benefit as a white person more from slavery or the past exploitation of asian workers more than a minority. All americans are able to take advantage of a country that got its start from tobacco and cotton crops that relied on slavery. All americans are able to take advantage of coast to coast train transportation and shipping made possible by exploiting chinese workers. As I have previously stated Caucasian-Americans are now paying the price for other people’s sins through programs such as affirmative action.
“Would you then call financial aid a classist policy, even though it exists to create a parity between lower economic brackets and higher ones? I mean, a richer student’s great great great grandfather could have been poor.” These are completely different situations no matter how hard a student worked at home there is nearly no possible way for them to elevate themselves to the same level as a billionaire’s daughter whereas should a minority student work hard it is completely in their power to achieve the same academic levels as their white counterparts.
Just treat individuals as, you know, individuals. Simple, right? Apparently not on this campus for future second-rate bureaucrats.
I’m tired of this intellectually childish (I should probably just say “undergraduate,” but I won’t) view on “racial integration.” The issue should be “ability to racially integrate,” not “current degree of racial integration.” Are there legal or other coercive barriers preventing individuals from going from A to B? Are there underlying institutions that reinforce the views that result in said barriers?
These are not questions that we can answer simply by “having a dialogue” and talking about how some persons may have a “feeling” of alienation. All this idle chatter will do is a) create an echo chamber and back-patting session for race-
obsessed“conscious” morons with too much time on their hands, and/or b) sorry, there is no b).Whatever source you’re getting this drivel from hasn’t been keeping up on the latest cognitive research on racial identification. One example: Data shows that infants tend to demonstrate their own-race face bias unless they are raised in an environment that is racially diverse. It starts early, which is why having your stupid little chit-chat sessions for 18-20-something-year-olds won’t do, as the kids say, shit.
Go read a goddamned book or study for your courses instead of looking for university-sponsored airings of your uninformed, childish, stupid MERE opinions.
The same advice goes to whomever was throwing around “Caucasian-American” like a little David Duke.
Wow you leave the discussion for a few hours and fall behind!
@K
“How would you suggest making up the difference for minorities (and I’ll go ahead and include the economically disadvantaged there)?”
Oh that’s too easy! You shouldn’t. Life isn’t fair sweetheart and I’m sure you know that. Making you (if you are white) or DTOM (if he’s white) pay because of racism against my family years ago that you had no part in is…duh duh duh Wrong! Everyone has some kind of disadvantage in life and it is not the government’s job to fix it. My family, is so patriotic because in America the impossible is possible…without handouts. I guess I was raised with a strong sense of individual responsibility and a good work ethic. As stated earlier life isn’t fair and if the government keeps trying to make it fair by discriminating against one party to elevate another, we make it worse. The best we can do to make things fair – is to leave it alone and in time it will work itself out.
“Should a latin@ person with an ethnic name just accept the fact that homeownership, loans, job interviews will be harder for him/her to get and move on with it?”
Well first off you are assuming racism. Where is the hope and change in all that? That’s definitely a no go – especially because that person who is conducting job interviews is these days a more than likely white liberal feeling ‘white guilt’ who wants to diversify their workplace or neighborhood and will bend over backward to help someone with a last name like “Arroyo”. If I’m not mistaken that’s one of the reasons we got into this financial mess. We gave loans to the “economically disadvantaged” because we felt bad for them. Then guess what happened? They couldn’t pay their loans. Oops!
“If you’re against discrimination then how would you suggest ended institutionalized discrimination without programs such as affirmative action?”
Well, this here is the problem. These days, even the poorest minority child who has never been out of his bad neighborhood can go to school wherever he chooses. How? That’s easy…work for it. Oh I know what people will say – what about their family history there is alcoholism or drugs, etc. Or, but the schools in that neighborhood are SO bad. As I keep repeating this is individual responsibility. If that child works hard and studies then soon he will become one of the top students at that “failing school”. There are so many scholarships, internships, and organizations whose main mission is to help disadvantaged minority students that it will make your head spin.
You may disagree with my arguments…but I’ve seen them. I’ve seen my fellow “minority and economically disadvantaged” peers succeed because they CHOSE to. If they didn’t succeed, and I’ve seen that too, it was their fault.
This is America, we have the right to succeed…and also the right to fail. The outcome rests upon us, and us alone.
@Jen
Sorry, the line about his grandfather was more of a joke. Pulling the ‘ancestors didn’t own slaves, how can they benefit from racism/how could I be a racist’ card is tired and (clearly) not relevant. Just because one thinks their not racist doesn’t mean they don’t benefit from their race, basically.
I don’t really know how to answer that last question without having to look up some statistic and studies, but no, not particularly, since most of the widespread discrimination against Irish and Italian people has ceased to be implicit or explicit in America today.
And I don’t know what you’re arguing in the last paragraph — that white privilege is based on nationality? It’s a race-related privilege; I’ve got it and I’m an ethnic minority.
@ Britt:
I got no idea. Clearly your immigrant family is way better than mine. Congrats, let’s never try to make people’s lives better through institutional and societal change, because if some people do it, then everyone can. Your anecdotes have totally persuaded me to your side.
@ Britt – amen.
Affirmative action is about as necessary as reparations.
@K
Your sincerity overwhelms me. If all of the people who agree with you have such gracious attitudes its a wonder we aren’t a utopia by now….
BLA BLA BLA BLA- Charlie Brown’s adults. The bottom line is this (in my opinion of course) GW is not diverse in one very simple regard. MONEY MONEY MONEY. I dare say if you took a poll of those that are on scholarship or have a large financial package many would say yes. Clearly many of the white and whatever else (yes I am not forming any sort of academic conversation currently) and I refuse to be Politically correct. Race discussions should ALWAYS continue. There are severe and I mean severe disparities. It is clear to me that the captive audience above spends all their time right here in foggy bottom when they are living in CHOCOLATE CITY. Look around you. . . the disparities are vast. It is important to discuss the “Black issues” because so many blacks are living below the poverty line in America- I am not saying GW students per se- and I am also not saying that other students are not either. But there is surely not an acceptable amount of black professors. In the school of public health there is not one. We discuss race disparities all the time!!! Do you think it is ever coming from someone of color? NO. As the official snowflake of my crew and the only white member of the Black Public Health Student Network which I ADORE. . . and was welcomed with friendly hands. . . I am always willing to step out of my comfort zone and take a chance- and so for that the guy that wrote this. . . well done for putting yourself out there. . I just don’t agree.
All I can say is Wow… I just want to make a point that my family and I never knew of racism until we came to the United States and I am a triple minority based on this country’s ideals(Foreign-caribbean, “black”, Female)
I’ve heard of this ” So where are the Caucasian-American cultural/ethnic groups?” argument before I cannot seem to understand why ANYONE finds it to be valid. “Caucasian” is not an ethnic group. Its a politically correct classification of color. Just like “Black-American” which is also a classification of color. Not necessarily your background (These classifications have always bothered me…) It would be more appropriate and VALID to say Irish-American or French-American or Slavic-American and Nigerian-American. THOSE are cultural groups and when you dig deeper, you find the ethnic groups.
(Sheesh people…)
Frankly, I’m tired of people standing on these self-righteous soap boxes of “My parents (and the society I grew up in) taught me these ideas and were so persuasive that I believe them whole-heartedly now without ever really looking at the arguments objectively, therefore I shall shove them down everyones throat and if they don’t agree with me I’ll scream bloody murder until they do.”
Its these superficial discussions of race that do the damage, that cause the disparity, that inhibit the pain. No one wants to talk about what the REAL cause of all this is. Racism is a symptom. You have to nip the disease in the bud before the symptoms will clear up. The disease is fear, uncertainty, ignorance, etc. Until people stop fearing each other over the most ridiculous things (seriously people…skin color? eye color? hair texture? These are things to fear?) We’re stuck…
Let’s just hope OUR baby brothers and sisters can get it right… but I doubt it. They still have us teaching them this crap.
Now, I–the triple “black” minority am going to go home to my Irish-American boyfriend of four years and talk about what we are having for dinner.
@kim
The term Caucasian-American, as I use it, is meant to be a cover all term for European-Americans. While you can divide people up into nationalities we commonly do not do so with African-Americans so I was just applying that same mentality.
“Frankly, I’m tired of people standing on these self-righteous soap boxes of “My parents (and the society I grew up in) taught me these ideas and were so persuasive that I believe them whole-heartedly now without ever really looking at the arguments objectively, therefore I shall shove them down everyones throat and if they don’t agree with me I’ll scream bloody murder until they do.”” This, at least for myself is not the truth. My opinions are mine alone and have been developed and influences over my life. The concept that I would be weak-minded enough to just argue what someone told me is true is offensive and I look forward to your apology.
@JanaB
In addition I do not care about what race anyone is. Thats my whole argument. By highlighting the “problem” of a lack of black professors at GW as a problem there is only one clear solution, to hire such minority professors. The only problem is every other university in America wants to do the same thing which means the best professors will go to the best colleges. With a limited supply it is quite likely that if we are hiring a professor solely on the basis of race they will have an inferior teaching ability to other professors. Before anyone calls me racist this does not have anything to do with the professor’s race. It is simply that as a percentage of the teachers in america there are fewer minority teachers, hence the grouping of minority. However, each school wants to be as “racially diverse” as possible. What then happens is a school is so desperate to dodge the racist label they will hire the first quasi-qualified person for the job if they have the right color of skin.
By ignoring race completely then everyone has an equal chance. I personally do not care what ethnicity my professor is, as long as they can teach.
To: Don’t Tread On Me
I would like to clarify that my comment was directed to the overall tone of the comments placed on this forum. Not at you specifically. I have no time to directly attack anyone. It is unnecessary and demeaning to me personally. You want an apology for my opinion that was developed from the other overall comments written yet you you offer no apology for your opinions that have also obviously offended. Isn’t it rather hypocritical to say that you essentially have a right to your opinion regardless of whether or not someone agrees with it, yet ask me to apologize for my own?
If you are the knowledgeable/intelligent individual I perceive you to be, you should then take the initiative to separate yourself from these base ideals and generalities of race classification ie. “Caucasian-American, African-American”. The general mentality you referred to is a cause of this mess. Transcend these “politically correct” terms and finally bring some meaningful dialogue to these issues.
With all respect and sincerity,
Kim